Wizard Wednesday Episode 75 Transcription
Wizard Wednesday Episode 75 February 8th
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Elf: [00:00:00] It is Wednesday, we're wizards and today is a magical day that we call Wizard Wednesday. Channeling in from the quantum downs with so much quantum style. This is your cult leader, elf and
Dotta: Doda Bear
Elf: Snake is Oh bear snake. I dunno. I dunno where he is. Come on up here, bear. He's, uh, well I'll tell you this.
He's driving, um, to San Francisco right now. Uh, and in fact I am in San Francisco. Doda is in San Francisco. We are actually, uh, all sort of in transit because, uh, we came up here to, uh, visit our partners by Sonic, uh, who are making the game.
Dotta: Don't worry everybody, I'm here.
Elf: Hooray. We were worried. Barry Wizard Wednesday today.
Um, Yeah. Yeah. I, I [00:01:00] thought I was gonna be a few minutes late, but I made it right in time. I just got to my hotel room. Uh, we have a massive show today. The universe is going exponential. I can't keep up. We've got ai, we've got deep fakes, we've got Black Sands, we've got ROS card game, we've got Bitcoin NFTs, we've got 3D rigs.
It's too much. Dota. How, how are we gonna keep track? It's too much. Well, we better get started. I don't know. Let, let's just dive right in. Ok. Um, yeah, where do I even start? Let's, let's start with the 3D rigs. Um, so I distributed, I don't know, like 12, 10 or 12 of them, uh, last, uh, geez, was it yesterday? I don't even know what it was.
It was a few days ago. Um, and we're already seeing awesome results. Um, and when I say I delivered them, uh, it was with a lot of, uh, it was with a lot of help from, uh, frog Eater and Molly, the 3D team at Magic Machine. Um, [00:02:00] and you know, I we're, again, we're already seeing so much awesome stuff. Uh, mag was.
Night, Al Birdman, Chub, Tabitha, you all have been making great things. Um, and, and I'm really glad, glad to see it because it's really serving as an excellent test period. Um, you know, I'm already seeing a lot of like terrible mistakes that we need to fix. Um, CHTA, Bob's Black robe, for example. Clear, clear issues with that.
Um, Tabitha, your renders are way too shiny. Um, so there, there's definitely a lot of things that we wanna fix, but regardless, I'm just seeing such great stuff out of it.
Um, I could go on, but I just wanted to pause in case anyone, anybody wanted to interject. Um,
Dotta: I'm very excited for 3D models. I think that, like, I've been somewhat jealous [00:03:00] of all the cool stuff I see coming out of clx and, uh, I'm like very much looking forward to being able to participate. Right? There's like an infinite amount of possibilities with 3d, both, like using Blender to do artworks, being able to use Unity and Unreal to like drop them into like mini games and full on games.
Being able to use 'em in other metas is just like really unlimited
Elf: potential. Yeah. I, I just, I wanted to say one of my favorite things about 3d, um, and it's not even the 3D character itself, uh, but when you have a 3D character, you suddenly have access to an extremely powerful storytelling tool. That is the 3D camera.
Um, if I gave you a 2D character, uh, if you wanted to change the camera on that, you have to totally redraw the character. But with 3d, you can move the camera around and make an entirely new image. And when you start playing with a camera and moving it, angling it, cutting shots together, now [00:04:00] suddenly you're playing in the realm of cinematography.
Um, and so Mag was here. Or Woz, as we call him, has been doing some really fun things with the camera. Um, you know, and it's like, sure, you've, you've got like wizards dancing on the lawn of the secret tower, and that's fun. But by adding camera moves and cutting shots together, uh, suddenly there's this whole new entire entirely new feel to it.
Um, you know, so now he's like a director, uh, making short 10 minute films. Um, you don't even need to make super elaborate sets or backgrounds or environments, and you don't even need sophisticated character animation. You can do the bare minimum with all that, but if you have really awesome camera work, suddenly you're Steven Spielberg.
Um, so yeah, just, just keep that in mind, you know, I mean, uh, Niall Birdman did, did, made a really fun music video. He made a really great set, awesome lighting. Uh, Birdman. [00:05:00] I didn't even know that you knew how to do 3D so well, but you're clearly an expert. Um, but yeah, I just, I don't know this, I, I'm so glad that we finally, we're finally rolling 3D out.
I also am
Dotta: very curious to have more educational material on how to use 3d, because I do think that it is somewhat daunting, right. You know, we can throw it into mix amo and do some basic animations there. But like, I would love if our team or someone could put together like, let's say like a, a blender preset lit scene, right?
Where like, um, even just getting the basics of like, here is some lighting that doesn't look terrible, would be incredibly, uh, like useful. Um, so yeah, I don't know if frog eater or you or, or someone in the audience wants to put that together, but being able to have a pre-lit scene
Elf: would be so helpful. Yep, for sure.
I mean, you know, that's, it's definitely one thing we wanna do is make, uh, like a sort of, I don't know, sandbox arena for, uh, people to play with these rigs in, [00:06:00] um, so that the, uh, it's more user-friendly. Uh, but yeah. We'll, and, and we'll definitely get more documentation out as well. Cool. Um, also, I just wanna see, say real quick, um, I think there's probably a lot of goblin town, uh, fans in, uh, the space today.
I don't think we're gonna do any Goblin town questions today. If, if we have time at the end maybe. Um, but just, I just wanted put that out there cause we have so many other things to talk about. Uh, okay. I, I also wanna talk about just another awesome thing that Woz, uh, has been doing and, and I just, I just wanna say real quick, um, Apple computer, one of the most, uh, powerful, uh, valuable computer companies in the history of the world.
Uh, the reason that they are so is because they had a woz on their team. And seriously, and, and this is why, uh, magic Machine Mag [00:07:00] Wozniak. Yeah, exactly. This is why Magic Machine is gonna make it cuz we also have a Woz on our team. Um, and so, you know, if you, first of all, if you're not following Mag Wazes Twitter account, do it.
Excellent content. Uh, but one amazing thing that he did recently, uh, is he got me onto the Joe Rogan podcast. Um, no, it was not Bear Snake who did this. It was Mag Waze. He opened a virtual, he opened a virtual door. Yeah. Um, and no, but all in all, seriousness Mag was here. He's just been doing some amazing things with ai, some deep fakes, some voice synthesis.
Um, and I, I actually, I mean, I know for a fact that we did fool a lot of people into thinking that I was actually on Joe Rogan, uh, last week. Um, so I don't know. Look, look, look forward to more fun things, uh, coming out of that, uh, that territory. Yeah. Just to, just to tag onto that, [00:08:00] you know, I think even with the 3D models as well, um, you know, we had a call this morning lock and, and was, and, uh, I think, you know, It, it's just, it's amazing when you have someone not only who, who not only has the technical skill, but has the creative bone to be able to pull this stuff off.
Um, and know Yeah. And know that, uh, nothing has to be perfect. Not that what he's doing isn't perfect, but like this whole idea, you know, this is whole idea where you could, you know, you could be in a recording studio and mix a song for the rest of your life, right? You could, you could film a movie and edit it and never release it.
And I think there's a, there's a lot of power in, in knowing. When to put something out. Um, and so Woz has that and, and yeah, we're, I think there's gonna be a lot with the 3D models, there's gonna be a lot of opportunity to create more content, even for other social platforms that I think wasn't possible for us.
Um, and I think we're gonna have, you know, a big, uh, [00:09:00] you know, a big part of the discussion is, is like empowering everybody who has these models, which will be everybody soon is to, is to sort of follow our lead or, or go in your own direction. But, uh, you know, the creation of content, I think is going to be the most powerful thing coming out of 3d.
Um, and all the AI tools that laws is using. Yep. Um, speaking of making cool shit, uh, there, there's been two just huge projects coming from the community, uh, this week and last week. Um, the, we've got a whole new pony mint happening on Black Sands. Uh, and then also the Ros trading card game just really took the community by storm last week.
Um, if give a hoot, if, if you're here and you wanna come up and talk about it, please do. Um, and then leg itus, if you wanna talk about Black Sands also. Oh, there's a, I think this is hoot. Um, [00:10:00] uh, ROS tcg, uh, you blew our minds last week. Um, I could go on and on and on. About how much I loved every detail and component, but, but let me give the floor to you for a minute.
Uh, how did you pull off such an amazing project?
Cult Member: Hey, sorry, I cut out for a second. Are you referring toros or
Elf: blankets? Uh, uh, ROS T cg. Tell us why it's so freaking awesome. Um,
Cult Member: well, I mean, we're inspired by the cult. That's first and foremost. I mean, um, the, the creative creativity of the cult's always an inspiration, and so it kind of makes you want to like, do better and like, and build a product that like, you know, is that you're proud of.
Um, and so, yeah, I don't know. We're super proud of it. We've been working on it for over a year now. Um, and, uh, obviously got the Dow funding in the middle of last year and that kind of enabled all of this. But, but yeah, seriously, first and foremost, I [00:11:00] mean the colt, Leo, the dev partner, and I, um, Put a lot of time and effort into it, but every single step along the way, there was a cult member helping us.
Um, whether it was from lower writing or beta testing or alpha testing or, um, obviously all of the artists that we, um, commissioned for the corset. Um, a lot of them were from the cult. A few were from outside the cult, which is super fun to kind of get them involved and get them, um, yeah, get 'em involved with a, a cult project.
And, uh, from what I could tell all the artists really loved, um, just like the world building aspect of rooms. I think, um, there were a few times when, when artists talked about how sometimes typically commissions can kind of be more like, here's what I want. Um, and, and do that. But Ros kind of took this approach where we, you know, we thought up a name, like a visual description and a lower blurb, and then I kind of just let the artists run and use their, like, and by design really wanted them to, to.
Kind of illustrate in their [00:12:00] unique styles. And I think that that, um, has really shown through the core set. Um, and, uh, and yeah, I don't know. So I'm, I dunno, uh, rambling the, the cult's amazing. Um, and yeah, and also thank you so much everyone for, to, for kind of, um, supporting the project and, uh, and kind of like giving us their feedback and getting involved.
And every single little interaction gives Leo and I like that much more of a reason to keep building it. We wanna, like, we're just blown away by how it was received and all of the good things people have been saying. We just wanna make it better. Um, and, uh, and, and yeah.
Elf: So what I loved is how you talk about this is just as much a world-building project as anything.
Um, you, you look at the images on the cards and then they all have descriptions. And I feel like, like you doubled the size of the Wikipedia just by releasing, what was it, like 64 cards? 64 cards? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's incredible. Like the wor like the [00:13:00] universe just took a huge leap forward, um, in it, in its build.
And I, I, I also just really love how you got, as you, I think you told me, seven different artists from the community involved in, in making the artwork. I.
Cult Member: Yeah, so seven different artists. I'm pretty sure two of them had, had never done, um, artwork before for the, for the Wizards. Uh, uh, one of, um, Brad's friends who's remain remaining anonymous, has been going by Coco Elli.
Um, the, that's the artist that did the Rone Ball captain, the astral snail, the um, abominable snow mimic. Um, it is just seriously so freaking good. The, oh my God. Uh, every, every, the cobalt attorney, like they did all those cars. They're so good. And then, uh, BKK Bros, who is kind of adjacent to Wizards. He's, um, actually really good friends with Mt.
Who, um, does turf and is a wizard. And then, um, I think D K K B D K B B Q. Um, uh, has, I've also refer [00:14:00] like one way back when I was sourcing artist for this thing, I kinda asked around and um, DK BBQ was like, dude, bk Bkk Bros is like the best pixel artist in the biz. And so reached out to 'em super nice. And so those two artists had never done work with the cult, and now they did.
And now, um, and so they're part of, they're part of the universe.
Elf: Um, fan. Fantastic. I, I, yeah, I, it's, you know, it, what's fun is like, I remember when I was a kid and I used to play magic cards. I always loved the artwork and I loved how they had a ton of different artists, uh, contributing artwork to the set.
And that's how I learned about a lot of new fantasy artists just through magic. Um, and so Ros, t c g had that same dynamic. Um,
Cult Member: yes, I, and actually, and I love that you called it out cuz one, like, one thing that I thought that like. There, there are a bunch of different ways that I thought ruins could be a success, and one of them was simply giving people a reason to look at art.
Like, and you, what you exact what you said is exactly [00:15:00] my experience with magic where, um, I'm, I'm like a, like, I don't know what the side of the brain is for like math, but I'm like a very math side of the brain person Growing up, I, I don't know, like art never sp you know, I didn't listen to a ton of music, this and that.
I love strategy games, I love numbers and so I played so much magic growing up and one thing I realized over in my lifetime is that, Playing magic was fun and stimulating from a strategy perspective. But little did I know that I was just staring at art that's more like I was just staring at art. And that's like a huge piece of utility that, that these kind of games can bring is they put art in front of you and even if you don't realize it, you're just staring at art, whether it's the music.
Oh, and I forgot to mention, yes, we had seven illustrators do the corset, but also not to forget Tad Major who did the animation for the pack opening and Dr. Slop who did the music for the For the Pack opening also to Artists of the Cult. And, and I was like, ruins. Ruins is, ruins is a success if it gives people another reason to look at [00:16:00] art and experience
Elf: art.
I'm, I'm glad you mentioned the pack opening thing. It's like, Dota always says he wants to capture the joy of like, cracking open a pack of magic cards. Yeah. And I remember, like, I, I bought like five packs and I thought it was just gonna be like a very bland ui opening it up. I don't know why I thought that, but that's what I did.
And then I remember clicking the open button and holy shit, it was, it was pure magic. The music, the animation, like I had the biggest grin on my face through the whole thing. It was so good. I wanna
Dotta: echo that. Yeah. We always do talk about trying to replicate the joy of opening a pack of magic cards. And truly, you really did.
Um, I, um, I love buying cards on eBay. My kids like, make fun of me. Like whenever I crack open eBay, I like buy, like, you know, I just like the cards from when I was a kid. So I always am buying like third edition and like from that [00:17:00] early era magic cards. Mm-hmm. And I have a box in my closet that like, um, of these, like repacks from that era that like, whenever it's like a rainy day or whatever, I'll, like, I savor them and I save one and I go and I open it up and like, and so I say that saying that like, I recently have the feeling of opening up a new pack of magic cards and opening my like, ROS tcgs.
What, like, was the same thing, just as much joy. I was so thrilled, so happy. I've still got a handful of packs, like saving, saving for another rainy day. So I just, uh, I loved it so much.
Cult Member: Amazing. Yeah. I'm so glad you loved it. That was, I mean, obviously it's, you know, yeah. Inspired by the cult wanting to, wanting to kind of, um, replicate all of the experiences that people have kind of been building and kind of, and like kind of hips, I don't know, super high standard for things that are built within the cult.
And I was talking to Leo and we talked about pacs, and I was like, Dude, like we could just do, like, we could just do a simple bland min, but like, what if like, we actually opened the pack and [00:18:00] all and we're just like, yeah, of course. Why not? We're gonna definitely do that. Um, and so, uh, so yeah, definitely huge shout out to Tad major and Dr.
Slur for that. And also Oz for the card art. For the pack art. I mean, um, the packs look amazing. And then Tad animating the packs, turning 'em around, blowing them up, having the rooms come around in a circle. Um, it was just, yeah, it's so much fun. Um, and
Dotta: also,
Elf: how many cards
Cult Member: are there? How many cards are there?
Uh, 64. 64 cards. And each card has two versions of the art, both. Both the standard and alternative, uh, version of the art, which is a little more rare, kind of like a shiny card. So, um, 64 cards, but 128, um, unique pieces of art.
Elf: I'm gonna ask a question that everybody's wondering, why not add five more
Dotta: cards?
Huh?
Cult Member: Why not? Huh?
Elf: I was making, oh God. Explain a joke. I'm gonna go lay
Cult Member: up. Oh my gosh.
Elf: Why not bear, keep your eyes on the road. [00:19:00] Maybe won't invite me up as
Cult Member: co-host. Oh my God. Yeah. I
Elf: love
Madotsuki: how, yeah, cuz I love it. Definitely did feel like opening up card packs cuz like, I love how when the ruins come out, you like individually have to click this like reveal the card that's under it.
It's like that same feel like how would you replicate, like digital feel Like when you open a pack and you have to move the first card up to see the card that's below it. Like know, like, so you kind fan out the cards to see what's in the pack and that's like the best way of representing it is like you click the little, they're hidden and then you click the ruins and they pop
Elf: out.
It was really great. I totally agree. Matto. I was, I was gonna say that, but yeah, like, like that little detail just actually has so much value and meaning. Um, you guys just thought through every little step and I, I loved it.
Cult Member: Yeah. And, and, uh, and also, and, um, again, I know I wanted to highlight also, um, part of the huge part of the production of the corset was obviously thinking about these creatures and these people that would, that'll would live in the Lu [00:20:00] Universe and exist in the universe.
And, um, a huge part of, like, a huge part of how we had 64 unique Creatures is the Book of lore. And also, and just like just the cult members in general, everyone was super willing to contribute ideas and help. Um, got multiple things from pings from like Cosmic who was super inspired to kind of help. Uh, and I was like, Hey, you know, I have this lore for creature, but I wanna know if, like, what's, what's your take on, on the, like the day serpent, for example?
I wanted to kind of get her unique biological scientific take on it. And then we'd like riff for a bit and talk about the lore and stuff. And, um, I mean, 64 cards is. A lot of cards actually. And there were a lot of times when I was kind of like, I don't, I don't, I don't know what else to put in here. Like, I don't want to create a creature for just the sake of creating something.
I want it to mean something. And so, so many times I would find myself just sitting there kind of hitting writer's block and I'm like, wait, why don't I just go look at the book of lore? Like why am I not just looking at the book of lore for all these ideas? And every time I did it took me like five, 10 minutes to find something [00:21:00] amazing.
And, um, you know, from Malevolence Art Grave Lord to, um, K kb G's Kaboom or gang, um, diehard, like all of those, um, characters are from just the book of lore. And um, and obviously when I would reach out to them, they're more than happy to kind of like lend their character to the core set. Um, and I think it just came out really, really, really well.
Um, and just highlights the power of like the. Platform. Like the, just like the, the collaborative storytelling and the collaborative legendary and like, and that stuff, that stuff just, you know, it, it doesn't just happen. Like it's not something just to kind of take for granted, like it's super powerful and, um, and was, yeah, it was just an amazing experience.
And I know that, um, I know El you'd mentioned that being kind of like a process that, um, you set other, um, collaborators with Brus, uh, with forgotten rooms had kind of gone through and I, I felt that exact thing. I was like, wow, this is amazing. Just this entire repository of like super duper or rich storytelling, [00:22:00] um, for an illustrations and yeah, it was just, it was incredible.
Elf: So much fun. Yeah. I mean that's one of my favorite things about what you did is you used the book of lore as source material that is literally the collaborative, legendary in action. It's, it's working. Uh, it's, the proof of concept is right there. Um, and we're seeing it again, and I freaking love it. Um, give Ahoo, we love it so much.
I'm, I'm gonna segue, um, into the next thing, uh, cuz I wanna make sure we have enough time to get to everything. Um, but so, so, so one thing that I've been thinking about recently is this, this sort of horizontal, uh, playing field that we're trying to build, uh, between Magic Machine and the the Cult. Um, and that ho that, that two-way horizontal playing field, it's, it, it has many different um, Components to it, that there's, there's the, there's, uh, the value share, the creativity, the development, the [00:23:00] world build.
All of this is on a horizontal playing field. And, and so like, what, what I'm getting at is like, I'm wondering like, like this first edition of Ruins Cards, you know, I think could be just as valuable as any token that, uh, that magic Machine creates. Um, and, and, and yet it's, it's, it's a cult created token.
Um, another place that I'm potentially seeing this is in the Black Sands Project that's currently, I believe it's minting today. Um, And so, you know, this, this started, this is started from, uh, the ponies that Magic Machine distributed, uh, in Christmas, I believe, of 2022, maybe 2021. Uh, yeah, 2021. And you know, the cult for a long time has been asking for like soul ponies or a, a, a second edition of ponies or pony breeding.
And the magic machine just simply doesn't have the bandwidth to do it, uh, anytime soon. And so the cult [00:24:00] said, okay, we'll do it. Um, and so Legist created this amazing, uh, community of Black Sands racers. And, uh, and, and now the community is building entirely new mounts. Um, and by the way, I contributed one as well.
Uh, mine is probably the least impressive of all the ones that I've seen. Uh, but Legist or anyone else who's, who's contributing to Black Sands, if you wanna come up and talk about it, please do. Um, But yeah, it's just like, you know, again, it's like, I wonder if like, like these Black Sands mounts, uh, are just so beautiful.
I think Acid eater is drawing a bunch of them, and I'm just like, you know, will these be as valuable as like the first set of ponies that Magic Machine released? I, I don't see why not. Um, the, you know, this is what the collaborative legendary is all about. Like, not only are we world building on a, on a narrative and lower level, but you know, the, just the, the creation is happening in, uh, in sort of every component of a franchise.
Um, and, [00:25:00] you know, if, if we're doing our job right, then we are empowering everybody to do just that. Um, but yeah, I don't see any Black Sands people trying to come up. Uh, Dodo have you, have you seen the, the new mounts that have been, uh, been released or mado or anyone. They look really, really cool.
Dotta: Um, and I don't know the mechanics, but yeah, I would love if someone from Black Sands wanted to come up and
Elf: talk about them.
There's the Black Sand they're coming up
Cult Member: and,
Elf: uh, hello Black Sands.
Cult Member: Hey. Yeah, that's, hi everybody. They got us here. Hey, thank you so much for, for letting me up.
Elf: Yeah. Tell us, tell us what's going on.
Cult Member: Yeah. So
Elf: Fantastic Day today is, uh, is our min the amounts are out. The adventure has begun. Uh, it's the day we're finally, we,
Cult Member: we, we show you guys what the more than 10 artists from the
Elf: s have worked on in [00:26:00] the past month or so.
And finally, we give everyone a chance to, to join the races. Uh, this is only the start of, of a long journey, so we're excited to, to, to do this together. And I can't wait for, for everyone to. To see the art that acid has been, uh, creating for all the makeup ponies, all of the art that that has been created for the one-on-ones from the other artists.
I would also encourage any of
Cult Member: them to, to come up and, uh, share the, the story
Elf: of their own, of their own one-on-ones without, uh, revealing too much. Uh, and for now, I leave it at that meaning saying, our means is life. We have a new website where you can learn all about our story, all about the
Cult Member: story of the races
Elf: and where there's gonna be much more of the races coming.
Uh, leave it at that. I'm unfortunately jumping between
Cult Member: meetings at work to make, uh, to make some
Elf: time for us and, uh, can't wait for what's come. [00:27:00] That's great. That's great. Mr. Brown, did you wanna say something about Black Sands or anything else? I.
Cult Member: I was gonna jump off if
Elf: Legis wasn't speaking, but he did a great job.
Okay. Awesome. Mester did, did you, uh, add any, uh, make any mounts for, for this new collection?
Cult Member: I
Elf: feel very blessed to have the opportunity to created, uh, ammo. Ffo. The Perton. Okay. Um, awesome. Uh, looks like Bill is coming up. Hello, bill. Hi everyone.
Cult Member: Hey. Acid's here too. Yeah, I just wanted,
Elf: just wanna say we, we've been working really hard for like, the last month to, uh, put everything together on the black band.
It's been a lot of fun. Uh, we've built a bot to, to make the dice rolls a lot easier for everyone. Um, we'll be launching the stables so you'll be able to go and [00:28:00] look at your ponies like abilities and treats and your treat roles. Um, and then also I think, We've got plans for,
Cult Member: uh, future development and that
Elf: kinda overlaps with what I was gonna do for babies and since it's wintertime acid and I are just hanging out inside, making art and doing codes.
So hope to bring you guys some really fun stuff really soon. You Acid has just been doing an amazing job on these mounts. They're seriously blowing my mind. They're, they're better than the ones that I made. Um, like, like I feel like acid is doing my style better than I do my style. Um, you created a meta,
Cult Member: it's great.
Elf: Ok, great. Um, no, but, and, and then I also, I also wanna give a shout out to Delta Mouse who's been doing a lot of the lore behind all of these mounts. Right. Um, yeah, that's been cool. [00:29:00] And shadows, illustrations. And then Laith has done like the music and then Magis Waze helped with the ai, uh, narration or something.
Amazing, amazing project. Yeah. Team effort, like there's so many people involved doing so many different things is truly amazing what Leg Itus has managed to put together. And I just want to say like Leg Itus is such a good project manager. He just.
Cult Member: He
Elf: just follows through and he circles back and he just gets in touch with everyone and he is just coming up with new ideas and bouncing ideas off of people's heads.
It has been truly a, a privilege to be building by his side. It is really amazing what everyone in the cult wants to, wants to do and wants to build. And I'm just here for it. This is the culture
Cult Member: we're here for.
Elf: Love it. Love
Dotta: it so much. Yeah,
Elf: and I think that's something [00:30:00] call out is like, um, and sorry, I'm in and out if you guys, hopefully you guys can hear me.
I'm driving. Um, something that I see in a lot of other discords, which I'm, I'm spending a lot more time in them is, uh, is just like, there's a lot of ideas, but there's very little action. And I think it's exactly because of that bill. It's, it's like there's, there's, there's ideas, but then there's like the, the drive to actually get it done.
And I think that comes from like, we're all, uh, Sort of pushing each other to like do our own part in a way that like plays to our skillset set. And, you know, it's just, it, it's just so beautiful. It's all just working. It's all just working and I love it. We are putting our rooms on our doors. That is right.
And that is an excellent segment to this next, uh, this next piece that I wanna do. Um, I think I wanna talk about this for the next 30 minutes cuz it's, it's, it's actually huge and it's actually kind of controversial. And if you've noticed, our good friend [00:31:00] Nisi is joining us. Nisia is staying up way past his bedtime just to talk about this.
Um, so Nis, welcome to Wizard Wednesday. I wonder if Nis can even hear me. Oh, there he is. Hello. Hello. How is it? Hey nis. Good. What's
Cult Member: up Ni? Hello? What time is it
Elf: there? Nis? What
Cult Member: time is it?
Madotsuki: Oh, it's, um, well with small kids it feels late, but it's only like 10.
Cult Member: Well, it's good to have you bud.
Elf: Yeah. So, so, okay. So yeah, we're gonna talk about the thing that has taken the community by storm.
And when I say the community, I mean the crypto community at large. And of course I'm talking about Bitcoin, NFTs, AKA Ordinals. Um, uh, this is, this was, uh, forgotten Roe's chance to leave their mark on a brand new world. Um, an old chain, but a new world. Um, you know, I want to [00:32:00] talk about the lore of the ordinals that we inscribed.
I want to talk about the technical, I want to talk about the community. Um, but you know, I, I, I'm just gonna put this out there, right off the bat, uh, Dota and NIS have already sort of established themselves as like thought leaders in this space. So I'm just gonna stop right here. Dota and nis. Do you guys wanna jump in?
Uh, yeah, sure. Um,
Dotta: well, uh, I could talk quite a lot. Nissy. I don't know if you, there's anything you wanna open with? Um,
Madotsuki: no, she's been a very exciting few days. Um, I guess we're both quite excited, giddy about it. So Yeah, you start Yeah. Ni
Dotta: may, NIS May, let's give you the floor cause you don't get to come with Wednesday the often.
Maybe you could talk about a little bit about what you think is like most interesting or important or like, you know, why you are also into Bitcoin
Elf: NFTs. As as I am. Yeah. Tell us why this is such a big deal and why we should care actually,
Madotsuki: Um, yeah, I mean there's, I think [00:33:00] there's, there's, there's several things.
I think one is obviously Bitcoin is like the original blockchain, right? So like everyone's excited about that. I think like trying to do NFTs on Bitcoin kind of seems weird and now it's possible. And I think that's super exciting. Um, and um, and yeah, I think it's just also the excitement is also there because there's, the tech is so like far behind.
So, you know, even basics, like how'd you get wallets set up? Like, you know, everyone's struggling to get a wallet, um, no one knows how to trade these things. Everything's done o TC with like, shady characters on Discords. You know, it's like kind of the early days of crypto where like, you know, you have to like figure out who you trust very quickly and, uh, form like relationships and, you know, join random discord and, you know, um, all of that stuff.
So I think there's like an element of like, you know, how do you kind of figure all this stuff out as quickly as you can? Um, but then separately, I think the whole like, You know, the fact that like Bitcoin NFTs are so different in that you're kind of inscribing them on the actual, like Bitcoins themselves cuz obviously they don't have like smart [00:34:00] contracts.
Like, I think from like a lore and like, you know, the whole um, kind of uh, interesting digital artifacts perspective. That's like, that's really cool as well. Um, so yeah, let's, let's like, I mean, you know, in like, in the normal like N F T world, we have like, you know, traits and things like to figure out rarity, but now suddenly you have this concept of like, well, there's like a global index or like a global, um, a global like number for when you have minted a specific Bitcoin, N f T.
So that like plays into rarity, you know, it's like a, you know, a, a first mint more important than like a later mint in the global order. Um, but also, like, which Satoshi did you, did you mint it on? Cause if you minted it or on a Satoshi, that itself is rare, then that's like a thing. Um, so anyways, yeah, I could like, go on, um, about this whole thing.
Yeah, it's been, it's been
Cult Member: fun and
Elf: interesting.
Dotta: Yeah. I think that like, you know, one of the things that I've got a lot on Twitter is people are like, oh, the Eths are coming in and like [00:35:00] trying to put, you know, NFTs on our Bitcoin and like, isn't that so quaint or whatever, and I'm just like, no, no, no. Like, I.
I am a Bitcoin person, right? So like I mined Bitcoin years and years and years ago, like I love Bitcoin. Literally the reason why I got into Bitcoin was because I was trying to build a software system for micropayments. Uh, like a, a system where you could basically do micropayments on Bitcoin to pay people for open source software.
Like I think that the open source software community has like a real issue in terms of like getting paid for people who write the code. And I was starting to work on some, some tools for that. And someone pointed out to me, they said, oh, have you looked at Ethereum? Because I think that the smart contracts would be a, a lot better fit for what you're trying to do.
And, and then they were like, completely, right, like my whole world opened up and I like went to Ethereum and, and sort of, I wouldn't say I never looked back, but just like. That's where the focus of my development efforts have been. But like, I don't know, I think like, deep down I'm a coiner at heart. I think that when you see, um, projects like punks where you don't, where you [00:36:00] want it to stay the same and be this like immutable art piece, that's a very bitcoiny type thing.
When you see things like, um, ether Rocks, which you have these sort of clip art rocks going for $2 million because they're this like store of value. Um, and, and there's no like roadmap. They're just this pure art that feels very bitcoiny to me. And even I think like the original Forgotten Ruins, wizards, one of the things that we did is we uploaded them to the Ethereum chain because we wanted them to be these like immutable, permanent, um, digital artifacts that like didn't change.
Now I think as a project we've talked a lot about, you know, shapeshifter and like other dynamic things. Like there's other things you wanna put on top of it, but I feel that kind of the origins of the Forgotten Ruins wizards is this very much like, um, You know, cipher punk view of like this immutable, uh, decentralized, uh, like stable store value.
And so, um, well, all these things feel very bitcoiny to me, more than maybe even Ethereum. And so the fact that you kind of can inscribe these bitcoin, these NFTs onto Bitcoin [00:37:00] feels like a breath of fresh air, right? Like, like as, as, as, as elf said, um, uh, it, it kind of gives you a reason to use your Bitcoin.
And so, uh, well, that's one of the reasons I'm very excited about
Elf: it. Yeah. I, I, you know, I, we, everybody here obviously loves Ethereum and, you know, we will always build on Ethereum and, and our love for Ethereum will never go away. But, you know, I, I just wanna echo that, you know, Bitcoin is what got me started in this whole thing.
We never talk about Bitcoin, but, you know, I just wanna give Bitcoin some love. It's the og it's got the biggest, most powerful network worldwide. It's unstoppable. Um, and it's, it's, you know, you, you gotta take some time once in a while to just appreciate what Bitcoin is, uh, and give it the respect that it deserves.
Um, yeah. And so, you know, the Bitcoin's important to everything we all do here. And when I say we all, I mean like magic machine and everyone [00:38:00] and the audience right now, and the crypto community at large, I mean, you know, you just gotta respect it. And so, Considering that respect, we thought this was a very important opportunity for Forgotten Ruins to put its mark on Thero of, or put its ro on the door of Bitcoin.
Um, and so last God do it, was it like a week ago now, or two weeks? Uh, yeah, it was not two weeks. Yeah, it was just like a week, I think. Yeah. Yeah. Like, like in the dead of night. Uh, Dota and I, and well, all three of us just started talking about like, you know what, Bitcoin NFTs is actually kind of a big deal.
And Dota was like, okay, like not even a thousand have been inscribed yet. We need to get in under this 1000 mark. Um, and so we, we batted around a few ideas. Um, we didn't just wanna like, just throw some wizards on there. Uh, you know, we, we really put a lot of thought about what we wanted to inscribe on the Bitcoin [00:39:00] chain.
Um, And for me at least, I've always been really fascinated about the, uh, mythology around Satoshi Nakamoto. Um, you know, th this, this, this person is one of the most fascinating figures in history. They, they created probably the most revolutionary technology the world has ever seen, or, or, you know, among the most revolutionary.
Um, and, you know, unlike every revolutionary technology before it, uh, we don't know who made it. So Toshi Nakamoto is the ultimate Black hatch, shadow Andon. Um, and so, you know, that narrative right there to me, uh, intersects with forgotten ruins insofar as we never talk about who the black hat wizards are.
You know, we talk about every color, but the black hats have always been kind of secret. Um, another secret in the universe is the quantum shadow itself. So I just kind of [00:40:00] wanted our, the forgotten Ros mark on the Bitcoin blockchain to sort of, uh, echo that. Um, and so we inscribed 10 characters. I don't even know if they're wizards.
Uh, and we're just calling them shadow hats. I don't even know if they're quote unquote black hats. Um, and yeah, I mean, the shadows, uh, I believe they hit right at as inscription number 9 69, which I also think is sort of a numeral logically prophetic number. Uh, 69 looks like an infinity symbol. It also looks like an ora boros, uh, which speaks to time and history itself.
Uh, so, you know, all this is to say is forgotten Ruins has, uh, made history. Um, we are forever inscribed on the Bitcoin blockchain and I'm just very excited about it.
Dotta: Yeah. Uh, when you mentioned this idea around like respect to, to Bitcoin, so I, okay. A few things. One, I've even been getting some tweets where people are like, why are you spending so much time on Bitcoin [00:41:00] NFTs?
Like, why can't you focus on wizards and Make me rich? Or something? Like, I literally have a tweet like that my dms. And, um, a few things. One, nothing has really changed with kind of forgotten ruins roadmap, right? Like the tooling on Bitcoin NFTs is almost non-existent. The market will take a long time to catch up.
I'm not saying that, for example, like, oh, all of a sudden the new meta is Bitcoin NFTs and like, that's where all, all of the traffic is going and everything's moving to that. No, no, no. It's really just like me trying to sound the alarm to be like, Hey, look, it's 2017 and the punks are minting. Like, don't miss this.
And like, yes, it's like very difficult to kind of use the tooling, but like, like clearly some of the, the, the, the, the NFTs that are minting over there right now are going to be historically valuable. And that's what I'm trying to like say, right? This, these first 1000 or these first 10,000 NFTs are only gonna happen once.
And so, um, You know, all of the same things around like Goblin Town, the show, the comic book, like, uh, the, the Universe game. These are all still happening. It's all still happening on eth. [00:42:00] We're not moving the Wizards to Bitcoin or any of that. Um, but on this idea of like respecting Bitcoin, I think one of the things that's really interesting and, and good to keep in mind is that the Bitcoin maximalist, even though they're a bit like zealots in their beliefs, they actually provide a lot of, um, uh, stability and structure in which the rest of us can kind of operate onto.
Like the amount of value that is kind of anchored in the system by people that believe in Bitcoin only is, is massive. And that actually sets the, the, the, the waterline for all the rest of us. You know, I think this applies more generally that sort of like, part of the wisdom in respecting your elders comes from this idea that like, Um, that your elders in their conservatism provide this, like this foundation that you don't even realize that you're standing on.
And then that allows you to kind of like, act out and create new art and destroy, because like, you always know that you can go home and there's like, you [00:43:00] know, a warm bed and a warm meal for you. And so I think that like, um, yeah, even there's so much tribalism of like eth versus Bitcoiners and there's plenty of Bitcoiners who are, you know, don't like me talking about ordinals or whatever.
But I think that like there's a lot of wisdom in kind of like recognizing that sort of like believing in Bitcoin is the one true coin actually underpins a lot of even what we do on Ethereum. So Matt, you have your hand raised. Feel free
Elf: to come up.
Cult Member: Uh, yeah.
Madotsuki: Like I, I was into Bitcoin long ago and then like, you know, I kind of like, you know, moved on to Ethereum cuz it was, there's like, you know, development is very slow over there. Everyone like, just likes the fact that like, Bitcoin doesn't really like, make any huge moves, like build on top of it. Like there's especially just like a huge, like, you know, there's like the bitcoin maxi and maxi tribalism stuff.
And a big part of that is like, you know, they're like, no, Bitcoin is perfect. It's like, almost like dogma. And they have like, kind of like the idea of like, Satoshi being like second coming price or whatever. It's like, you know, this is [00:44:00] Satoshi's vision. Like Bitcoin is just cash, nothing's doing used for it.
And it's like, I think a lot of 'em will realize, like, this is driving a lot of developer attention to like Bitcoin. Like there's a lot of devs who are like looking at Bitcoin is like, hey, like this is the first cool thing to happen to Bitcoin in like forever. And like, they're looking at like, like, um, somebody pointed out to you that.
There was a, a GitHub issued that was raised for like, um, potential for like partially, um, signed transaction on Bitcoin. So you can have someone, you can have like a trustless way to like trade these. Cause right now there's just no trustless way. Right. And it's like, that's awesome. Like, I think that's awesome that like anybody's even paying attention to that and like that would expedite like the development of those kinds of things when like nobody would really care before.
Cuz like, why would you care about like, you know, sending a specific, sending specific stats or anything. Like, it was just like, you would just like trade over the counter, like whoever you're doing it. Right. Yeah. Um, this gives it a reason. And, um, and, um, mm-hmm. Oh, just one really quick. I was gonna say like on the, the idea of like the immutability of it and stuff.
Um, I love how like literally everything is on chain. [00:45:00] Um, and surprisingly it's cheaper. Um, uploading stuff on, on Bitcoin and eth, which I was completely chugging and back by. So like, that's why like, it's, it's really cool. Um, and like this is almost like, I feel as if this is like, the best way to explain it to people was like, cuz a lot of people are confused cause everyone's throwing around like, you know, it's NFTs on Bitcoin, but they're not really.
Um, but it's the closest analog. And I think the best way of saying is like, this is almost like digital cave painting. Like if you think about like, anthropologists, like a hundred, 200 years later in the future, like this will be the first inscription. This is like, The, the, the entrance of the cave, the digital cave, and like, these are the first cave paintings that we're gonna see.
And you're gonna go deeper and there's gonna be more cave paintings. But like, this is what you're gonna first see when you come into the cave. That's why it has
Dotta: historical relevancy. Yeah. And everyone should know that. Um, uh, Over kind of the weekend. I'm, uh, uh, the week I was in the dms with Elf and Bear and Nissy.
Um, and I was also in the dms a lot with Matto and Sweet Bread who have inscribed a number of early and [00:46:00] historic and important NFTs uh, ordinals of their own. I mean, I love sweet breads, um, art in any context, but some of these early ordinals that we inscribed in the first 10 K are just a absolute grails.
Um, and so we've tweeted about some of them. Maybe I'll even share some of the tweets up here, but yeah, sweet Bread, of course, saw was another person who saw this as just like, this is important. I have to be there. I have to put my mark. And, and, and the results are just stunning.
Elf: Uh, oh, sorry. I was gonna say ruins, but go ahead, bear.
No. Well, first of all, I mado. I love that cave. Uh, That cave comparison. Cause it really does feel such a good way to put it. But something I just wanted to point out, and I know that we all, we already know this, but, and you know, I'm, I'm probably the newest to crypto out of the, I mean, I am the newest to crypto out of the three of us.
And I come from a world where, um, if you find something special, um, you keep it to yourself and knowledge is power and you're very sort of caging about it. And so, you [00:47:00] know, it still is, is so beautiful to me that when someone like Doda has Anis e has the ability to build something, um, their first inclination is to share it with other people.
And, uh, and I know that this is probably a theme that's, um, common among, amongst crypto, but I just, I'm just so happy to Yeah. I just think it's such a great, such a great aspect of the world that we're in. So thank you Dota for sharing.
Yeah, of course. Did you have a comment?
Cult Member: Yeah, yeah. Real quick. I just wanted to say, um, I couldn't be more, I couldn't be more thrilled that, uh, Dota and nis, um, you two have been so involved with the Bitcoin, N F t kind of emergence because honestly I couldn't think of better emissaries for the Ethereum community to kind of, um, you know, bridge start, you know, to possibly maybe [00:48:00] bridge the gap between two massive crypto communities that are, that are semi divided on some topics.
I think, um, you know, uh, you know, there's a lot of, like, one of the biggest opportunities of the Bitcoin N F T kind of narrative is just to. Have conversations about like what we're all doing here, why we're doing it, and if these conversations can, can kind of bring these two massive communities closer together that are close to some things, but obviously very far away and other things.
Um, I think that's a huge, I think that's a massive win. A massive win. And I think that, um, I don't know, and I think that Wizards are some of the perfect people to have those conversations with people who also wanna have conversations. Um, and then, and yeah, so, you know, uh, I just wanted to throw it out there.
Um, thank you two for doing what you're doing and kind of like bridging the gap and sharing knowledge and having like reasonable conversations with reasonable people, with reasonable perspectives. Um, and [00:49:00] uh, yeah, I don't know. It's just insanely valuable.
Elf: Thanks. Yeah, I love doing it. Yeah. Uh, just a quick plug, uh, dot and I did an interview with Decrypt podcast the other day.
It's out. Um, and then that same guy who, uh, did that podcast, uh, wrote an article and he included one, uh, some information from Nissy in that article. Um, but yeah, it's, you know, uh, let me, let me just give an aside here, uh, a quick growth hack. Um, for anyone who wants to be a leader, um, find the new thing.
And then just learn it before anyone else. Um, and you can quickly just become the authority on that topic. And that's what Doda and NIS have sort of done. I mean, like, like granted, like it takes a lot of knowledge beforehand in this particular context to even become like that authority. And, you know, I'm not trying to take it away from them, but it's just like, it's, you know, it's, it's amazing.
This whole thing is like only two weeks old it seems like, and people are already DMing Dota and NIS [00:50:00] and asking for their opinions. Um, and, uh, yeah, it's, it's just been really fun. And, and, and you're right, uh, ruins the, these, these two are excellent emissaries for this, this particular, uh, technology.
Madotsuki: Yeah, I was just gonna add, I feel like, um, that was one of the pleasant surprises that, um, you know, I sort of was slightly hesitant cuz you know, I, I mean I also know Bitcoin from way back and, and know there's like strong opinions on that side. So I was a bit hesitant, um, you know, when meeting all these kind of Bitcoin dev people.
Um, but actually they're all super nice and, you know, they're all, uh, they all just wanna build this thing together and uh, a lot of them, uh, you know, they just wanna buy some and trade some NFTs and it's kind of this common mission that's united us. So, you know, they're like, well, how'd you guys do it? Or there in eat land?
Like, how'd you deal with this problem? How'd you solve this thing? Um, and it's just been kind of really good and you sort of make new friends along the way and, and suddenly there's this whole like, new community of like, you know, btc, um, NFT people who, you know, heard about wizards [00:51:00] and they're all asking like, Hey, tell me more about these wizards.
What's the Lauren Wizards? Um, you guys all seem knowledgeable and, and helpful and you're actually nice and, and all that stuff. So I think, um, I think like it's kind of like we're planting some early seeds, which I think will, um, pay dividends for us, um, as a community as a whole in the future.
Elf: Yeah.
Dotta: And I just wanna point out cuz nobody else is seeing this, like what a total Chad NIS has been in the ds Yes.
Within these ordinal groups. Is that like the. The, because one of, you know, you think that like the dev community is so huge that there are like just thousands and thousands of devs who are like, must be swarming on this or whatever. But the fact of the matter is, is even in like dev world, there's of course like a, like a gradient of like areas of expertise.
And Nisi is in there like giving tech support, making suggestions, like providing technical insights. He's like totally at the forefront of, uh, some of these groups and being incredible. I mean, the technical details would are, don't really lend themselves well to voice, but like Nisia has been really just a, a [00:52:00] leader even in these little dev chats.
Elf: I mean, I would go on record and say nido to the smartest people I've ever met in my life. So it's cool to hear about all this. Hi, by the way, I just got to my hotel, so what's up?
Dotta: Um, also, can I just point out, look at the pin tweet up here of this ordinal inscription of Mag Devin of the quantum downs and just like my heart melts at like the life and the energy that is in that image, right?
This is another one for the history books of, uh, of why Mags Devin is so iconic. And this inscription, I think at the time that we did it, so this is Inscription 2009 or 62 that felt like, oh, we're so late, we didn't make it in the first 10 K. And then now when I look at it, I'm like, this is incredibly early.
Like I'm seeing people trade, um, you know, uh, uh, uh, inscriptions under 10,000 for, a lot of them are going for like half a bitcoin, a full Bitcoin, right? And so, like, this actually feels super early to me now cause I think we're close to like 20,000 inscriptions and it's just gonna
Elf: go crazy from here. So, [00:53:00] I want to talk about, um, another component to this, and that's the, uh, haters.
Um, I saw a few people even in our cult seeming to express, uh, a dislike for Bitcoin NFTs. I won't say any names, and maybe they've changed their nine their minds since then. But if there's anyone out there who thinks Bitcoin NFTs is a bad idea, um, you're totally welcome to come up and say, uh, or make the argument and, and will be nice, I promise.
But like Dota Ske, have you guys heard any good arguments against Bitcoin NFTs?
Dotta: Well, like one of the questions is just like, does it slow down the network and bloat the network? Okay. So let me give a, like an example. So one of the key ideas around Bitcoin is this idea of decentralization. And part of the importance of decentralization means that there's not just like one or two nodes that are validating the transactions, right?
You see this trade off [00:54:00] in some of the other L two s on, um, ethe, like Ethereum, L two s, where they might only have like literally seven miners. And that's a problem because you can have kind of this like, uh, gang of miners who can, uh, like collude dis censor transactions or whatever. And so one of the kind of like important points about Bitcoin is that, um, the minors, that there are implementations in different programming languages.
That, and that there are minors all over the world and that there are minors, um, that the, the, the, the, the. Um, technical requirements for running a minor is not too onerous or that like, at least running a node that validates the data is not too onerous that you can run a full node on, like, you know, cuz you can run a Bitcoin full node, um, not a minor, but like on a Raspberry pi where you can at least like download and validate the data.
And so one of the, um, objections to Ordinals and Bitcoin NFTs is this idea that you are bloating the blockchain by, uh, storing a bunch of data on chain that is not, quote unquote a financial transaction. And that's a problem because, um, you know, there's this concept of like the [00:55:00] marginalized user, right?
Like, like you don't have the ability, whether either by region or by money, um, to afford like this really high-end hardware or a bigger drive. Um, and, and so if people are polluting the blockchain, quote unquote, Um, with these images, then you're making it more difficult for decentralization because marginalized users aren't able to download and validate the entire chain.
So that's a fair objection to like not storing this data. There are ways to address it through, um, for example, pruning the blockchain. Um, not to get too like crazy in the weeds. Um, ordinals are stored within like taproot scripts, which is part of the like, um, it's part of like witness data, which means it can be pruned.
Um, but that said, it's still a valid objection, which is like everyone in the world shouldn't have to store your Jax fine.
Elf: So,
You bear, we can't hear you at all. Ros, did you have your hand up? Yeah. Yeah. Um, so,
Cult Member: uh, [00:56:00] and one objection I've also kind of ran into, which, um, I think is totally legitimate is, uh, is, you know, these, these dot eaves coming in and changing the Bitcoin blockchain, right? Like, because Bitcoin. Uh, stays the way it does because there are so many people who like it the way it is.
Um, and I I, there's a legitimate concern that, you know, some, some people might come and change Bitcoin in a way that increases the attack number of attack vectors I or reduces security, reduces privacy, something like that. And I mean, honestly, I think that's totally legitimate, right? But I don't think that that's something that's necessarily avoidable if you want Bitcoin to grow and, and like, uh, you know, ultimately.
And so, um, again, it's actually, um, one of the reasons why I am appreciative of like Nisi and Dota being in the conversation is like, um, I think, uh, Bitcoin and the fees are amazing, but we also don't want to go and change Bitcoin to something that it [00:57:00] isn't or doesn't do as well. And, uh, and actually, you know, uh, cease it from being able to serve one of its, uh, you know, it's.
It's purpose and what it does really well. So that's a, that's kind of a, a legitimate concern. I've, I've heard, but, um, uh, and yeah, I mean, you know, uh, I think the Bitcoin, I think, and that's why I think that's why having cordial really educational conversations between Bitcoin and Ethereum will help everyone understand each other and, and help us kind of achieve the best of everything.
Um, and so,
Dotta: yeah. Yep. Agree.
Madotsuki: Um, I was just gonna go ahead, just one last thing. I think the, I think, I think one concern that people will have, which is, you know, a replay of some of the conversations we had before, which is the whole like environmental impact, right? So, you know, now that's, now that we're back, now that we're on like proof of stake on eth, we can be on a, on a high horse and be like, Hey, look, we are, um, much better for the environment then, you know, all that, all that [00:58:00] stuff.
So, you know, there's, there's a whole debate probably that might get opened up around that, that again,
Dotta: Yeah, good point.
Madotsuki: I was thinking is like, we just finished getting rid of like, you know, everybody's saying we hate NFTs cuz they kill the environment. And it's like, okay, cool, now they don't anymore. And I was like, guess what?
Elf: Yeah, no, it is a good point. Um, you know, and it, it just, I just wanna reiterate, it's like Dota said, I, you know, magic Machine has no plans to do like an entire 10 k collection on Bitcoin. Um, in fact we, I don't think we have any plans to make major collections, uh, or inscriptions on Bitcoin, but we certainly wanted to at least make a mark.
Um, I've minted a few myself. Um, yes. And yeah, I, I just think it's just important, uh, to, to leave your mark on that history. Um, but man, time went by fast. Um,
Dotta: I can talk a little bit if you're interested in getting into Bitcoin NFTs. I [00:59:00] think, um, that one, know that the tooling is very rough. Um, two, because you have the Trade O tc, you have to be extremely careful, um, not to fomo in with someone that you don't know.
Oftentimes, the, um, the project creator is like kind of managing the, uh, like brokering the transaction and that seems to have worked pretty well. It's small enough now. Um, I think that like one of the things that I'm seeing is inscriptions under a thousand and inscriptions under 10,000. Um, certainly have a premium, obviously, like as it goes on.
The inscription number will matter less and less. But I do think that kind of like 1000, 10,000 are very like memeable numbers for what will be considered sort of, um, historic. I think there's a few projects that I know that are good. Um, well, no, I say no, that they're good. I, that I suspect are good. Um, I link to some of 'em this morning in like a tweet storm that were like some of the under one K.
Those are already starting to get [01:00:00] quite expensive, but um, again, I think that they're actually still probably relatively cheap relative to what they will be. Um, and then there's a handful of other projects in kind of the like, Sub 10 K space that I think are interesting. I'll name them here. Of course, I don't vouch for them.
I'm just trying to give you like a direction. But I think that like, um, there was one called like inscribed Pepe that seemed decent. There's um, there's like Bitcoin booze. I actually just like o tcd one of those this morning that looks really good. They're like these adorable little, like, I think they're like ghosts or something.
Um, and there, and there's a few other projects I'm happy to share. I'm, I only share that not because I'm trying to like, uh, pump my bags that I own both of them just so much as like, I bought them because I think that they, um, that they'll, that they'll go, so like the bitcoin booze for example, are going right now for like three and a half eth, um, which is like not cheap, but like, especially if you can get an inscription under 10,000, it just seems crazy to me that those wouldn't go for more.
Did you
Elf: wait, um, within a couple of, did you. [01:01:00]
Dotta: Yeah, they'll, they'll take payment
Elf: in you. Oh, okay. Weird. Okay. Well,
Dotta: because like a lot of people have more like liquid eth than Bitcoin who are like coming over. Yeah. So like, that's like 0.2, whatever.
Elf: Sure. Although that said there's way more liquidity in the Bitcoin ecosystem, which like speak Well, I think that, yeah, the market cap is way higher.
Um, it's like twice that a week. Yeah. Whi which like speaks to this like, other really valuable component of it, which is like, now there's something for all these Bitcoin holders to spend their Bitcoin on. I, I think you said that earlier, uh, in the space, but you know that, that's just really important to reiterate that point.
I think.
Madotsuki: Yeah, like if only like 20% of like the Bitcoiners get into doing this, then that's probably already more than the participants of e of people in Ether and NFTs. So it's like,
Elf: right. Yep. Yep. Um, Doda, do you wanna give, uh, a quick goblin town update before we go? Just. [01:02:00] Sort of talking about, oh yeah.
Dotta: Couple questions so people have questions about staking. Um, you know, I think I wouldn't anticipate staking, like we probably won't ship a full staking mechanism until after we ship Goblin Town. You know, the dev team for Magic Machine is still, uh, relatively small. Maybe we should grow it. Um, but yeah, we're doing things in order.
We're gonna ship Goblin Town first before you should be expecting staking. Um, and then for Goblin Town, we are continuing to work on it. We've got some really fun UIs. Uh, to share, uh, within the week. Um, and then, uh, we've mostly finished the smart contracts. We've mostly finished the backend. There's still a bit more there.
Um, so yeah, we're, we're working on this as fast as possible. Really. I wish we had it out yesterday. There's no speed limit there. We're like, literally, we're gonna ship it as soon as we can, can finish the code. Um, and so that's what we're doing. Um, but it's still a few weeks out. As much as I wanted to get it out, you know, I wanted to actually have it out by Christmas and, um, we've [01:03:00] like blown past that.
So sorry. Whatever. But it's gonna be super fun, right? It's this like, you know, on chain settlers of Catan with like, Thousands of people on a massive board. That's all like real time battles between your little screening goblins, trying to stave off beasts and, and, and foreign attackers. It's gonna be so fun.
Uh, I can't wait to play it, but you're still gonna have to wait. Yeah.
Elf: And just to the Goblin Town community, uh, thank you for screening all over Twitter. We hear you loud and clear. Um, and, uh, we're, we're trying to get everybody on the screen list. Um, we're, we're super excited to deliver the game, uh, nis.
Um, you've also been working hard on Goblin Town. Do you have anything to add? Um,
Madotsuki: no, other than, um, I really wish that we could do it as quick as possible. Kind of. Yeah. Like, yeah. It's just, uh, it's annoying how long it's, it's, we're, we're, we're all really like, um, you know, we are really keen to get it out and it's just, [01:04:00] uh, we get frustrated all the
Cult Member: time,
Elf: how long it's taken us.
I just think that
Dotta: it's like very hard to build like the, a real game on crypto. Like I think that Wolf game would be the only other game that I've seen that says like, on chain and as sophisticated as what we're doing. And so one of the good things that I like about it is I do, um, suspect that it'll have some staying power.
We're trying to design the mechanics such that like, it won't blow up in the first two weeks, that you'll be able to play it for a year or years and it will keep running. And so, um, you know, balancing it and then writing all the contracts. Gosh, Miske, I don't know how many contracts we have. I think it has like 20 contracts or something.
And so whatever. It's gonna be fun. You'll like
Elf: it. You'll like it.
Dotta: Yeah. Um, before we wrap up, one of the things that you mentioned before as you were saying that like, oh, uh, with Theros tcg, um, that it, that it grew the wicked, like doubled the size of, of the Wikipedia are the individual ROS cards and kind of their like, um, are they on Wikipedia and like linked together with like the [01:05:00] lore of what they talk about yet?
Uh, because if not, I'd love to put out a call for that to happen.
Cult Member: Yes, totally. Uh, not yet. Um, but it's on the very top of my list to add it to both the Wikipedia and then also, um, the Ros card game has like a wizard character that has a book of lore entry and, uh, this wizard character is, is collecting all the ruins cards in the universe.
And so they're gonna be in both the Wikipedia and, and the book of Lore, um, a hundred percent. So that's a great
Elf: call. Incredible. So
Dotta: as it stands, um, the Wikipedia is still allow listed manually just reach out to Magus Wze if you want to take part. Um, but you know, that's not because we don't want people to contribute.
It's just a fight spam. If anyone wants access to Wikipedia, please, please reach out. I think there's, uh, so much that we can add there that that isn't there yet. So, um, yeah. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks so much. Uh, give a hoot for, for all your work there.
Elf: Yep. The, uh, the universe is, is going exponential and it's so hard to keep [01:06:00] up.
And, and that's the way it should be. Um, I just wanna say one final thing about Bitcoin NFTs. Uh, You know, part of what Forgotten Ruins is about is exploring the intersection between technology and spirituality. Uh, the intersection between the magic and the machine, the intersection between the brain and the heart.
And uh, you know, I think Bitcoin forever has just been stuck as a machine. It's been stuck in the brain. It's been, uh, it's just been nothing but a technology that can be tracked on a spreadsheet. And, um, I think, uh, you know, Bitcoin is considered to be sort of a religion by a lot of people. Um, or at least at the very least, a cult.
Uh, and this cult has had its messiah for a long time. Satoshi Nakamoto. It's had its apostles and its evangelists and the, uh, Bitcoin Maxis and, um, You know, just like any good [01:07:00] religion, uh, that, that is not enough to make it go global and, uh, touch the, uh, hearts of the masses. Um, the church very early on discovered that they needed to start an into every mass with, uh, choir.
They discovered that their architecture needed to be beautiful. They discovered that stained glass windows did a lot to influence the emotions of the parishioners. They, uh, hired Michelangelo to paint the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel. And, um, you know, while a lot of NFTs inscribed on Bitcoin chain may not be quite as inspiring as the Sistine Chapel, um, We are bringing aesthetics to it.
Uh, we're bringing the culture and we're bringing the fun. And I think that it is critical for Satoshi's word to spread, um, uh, wide and far with, with, uh, these inscriptions with the art and culture. [01:08:00] Um, so I think it's a very important thing. I'm glad that forgotten ROEs at least made its mark on that, that, uh, that door.
Um, and with that, uh, thank you for coming to Wizard Wednesday. Um, anything else Joe, to bear, Nissy, anyone else? We're good.
Cult Member: Fun show.
Elf: Yeah. I'm glad we could have one screen in there. Um, okay. Well this has been Elf Doda Bear, nis, bill Mado, JIT Ruins, T tcg, master Brown, and a whole ton of goblins, uh, from Goblin Town, putting theirs on the door.